Alternator Discussion

[Seabass]

I bought a large case altenator at the jy out of a van yesterday. Took it to auto zone to have it tested and no dice. You guys know if the regulators are interchangeable between the smaall cas and large cases? I brought both junk altenators into work to play with when its slow.

[Seabass]

Swapped regulators and the large case altenator is now working if anyone ever comes across the same situation.

[PaulW]

[quote="Seabass"]I think I read on here that the 6 rib pulley can't handle 200 amps. Is that anything you guys have come across?
=====
Pretty sure I remember the discussion by Ryan and I think he said vee belts cannot deal with very high alternator amps and he recommended the serp 6 rib for high amps. The discussion came about when a guy wanted a 200a alt on his vintage Bronco. Vee belts are very old school. Multiple belts was a crutch that failed and that failure led to development of serp belts. Problem with dual vee belts is when one looses tension then the other one usually fails or slippage occurs.
Anyway if serp belts were not effective then all the new cars & trucks would come up with something else?
Of course with any belt drive the tension controls the limit of torque possible. A correct belt is mandatory.
PW

[Seabass]

The rib count and contact on the pulley limit what makes the ford 6 rib only good for 180amps per the link you gave me. He stated an 8 rib pulley would be needed to go past that. His reasoning for not selling 200 amp alternators.

I'm happy with my junkyard 130 amp van alternator though. Can't get it anywhere near battery voltage with all my loads on at idle.

[PaulW]

Good input Thanks

[hobbyturnedobsession]

That makes sense. I have a 150 amp mustang conversion alternator and when the stereo was on for a while the high amps would make the belt squeal a bit on start up.

[Wrightracing.net]

No. A single V belt will not support more than about 90 amps. Dual is a little better. A six rib serpentine belt is good for about 160-180 amps. .[/quote]

I have had a v belt on my Bronco 302 and run a 200 amp alt for 10 years without one issue. It does not slip ever. Even when I run the AC, stereo and 4 100 watt Hella 4000 lights. That was before I converted to HID lights. The thing charges at 90 amps at idle which is nice. I had the stock alt rewound and internals updated by Broadway Auto Electric in Lemond Grove CA.

I have run Baja to the tip and back atleast 5 times and tons of miles off road. I have carried a backup alt in my trip box.

My take on it is to keep it simple. Simple is better. When you start adding more bracket, more wiring and more components that is just one more thing to go wrong.

[Seabass]

You sure it was actually rewound? Seems light A LOT of work when 200 amps can be had out of factory windings. Where did you get your 90 amps at idle figure from? Your statement of producing 90 amps at idle with a "rewound" altenator seems to good to be true. Traditionally rewinds get higher output at higher rpm and not much output on the bottom. I learned this back when I built my toyota rock crawler with tons of loads and almost no charging system from the factory. Not as many options where available so I did a bunch of reading on rewound altenators. I got most of my info off the internet so... its got to be true right?

[Wrightracing.net]

You sure it was actually rewound? Seems light A LOT of work when 200 amps can be had out of factory windings. Where did you get your 90 amps at idle figure from? Your statement of producing 90 amps at idle with a "rewound" altenator seems to good to be true. Traditionally rewinds get higher output at higher rpm and not much output on the bottom. I learned this back when I built my toyota rock crawler with tons of loads and almost no charging system from the factory. Not as many options where available so I did a bunch of reading on rewound altenators. I got most of my info off the internet so... its got to be true right?

This was not a 3G Ford ALT but the stock one that came on the 1986 302 with Fuel Injection. I have had several alt's done by the same guys on different
vehicles, my motor home, a old Class 12 car and a couple friends trucks. Not all were 200 amp, the Motor home is a 150amp, the 12 Car was 140 and the other's were 200amp.

Not only did they Rewind the ALT they upgraded internals to handle the higher amp's. We checked the charging volts at idle with the AC on, 4-8.33 amp lights at 100 watts and the normal running lights and it still charged at 13.2 volts. With the stock alt I could not run the Hella Lights at idle without the charging volts dropping down below 12 volts and discharging the battery. I have no reason to disbelieve my ALT guys because they were straight with me when I asked to rewind other ALT's to 200 amps and they said the highest they could go depended on the alt being modified. An example of that is the motor home alt could not be wound more than 150 amps and my alt conversion for the VW 1835 motor could only go up to 140amps.

Broadway Auto Electric has for many years built quality stuff for us guys that race and play offroad. I have not checked with them in a while but if they are still in business I am going to take my 3G alt to them before I put the new 351w in my Bronco. This motor does have a serpentine belt on it.

But like I said, I never had any problems with the V-belt on my 302 with the 200 amp ALT. That is just 10 years of real world
time in the dirt and my Daily Driver for at least 6 of those years. Now I did change the belts every couple years without a failure and just a standard prep thing when heading to Baja.

Now the Bronco is just a toy and the never ending Project.
Cage,Coilovers, Long travel and so on. I would like to stroke the motor to a 408 before I put it in with the C6 swapping out the AOD for more reliability.

All of you guys know what its like to have the project list..

[PaulW]

I hope this helps
A quick web search tells me belt experience will vary.
Several guys say 200a and 6 groove works. Of course the serp setup drive lots of things.
Several say 200a and one vee belt works. And V belts often drive lots of things or maybe just the alt.
Ford uses a 8 groove serp for its 215A alt.
Anyway take the reports with a grain of salt because not enough info is provided.
Regardless I have no doubt that success with either belt & 200A is common.

Turns out specifying a belt has to do with more than just load (amps + accessories) the belt has to drive. Things like life and tension are big drivers. For V belts there are different sheaves some with more contact area when used with the matching belt compared to than other sheaves. For serp many manufacturers use different tension springs for different applications. Some use more grooves than others.
Of course if one has a 200a alt then how often will the it produce 200A. The answer is not very often for most guys and success is assured regardless of the belt used.
Frequent replacement of belts for the high amp setup is prudent because the slippage and consequent wear is often quiet and gradual.
Bottom line is use what you have a listen for the squeal. If it squeals at idle then look for fixing the problem.
Once you have a solution then carry a spare belt and the tools to replace.

A lot of us have gone down the path for more amps. I tried to put alternator stuff in one place
Reference material for Alternators
You have to love this guy, Ryan, for electrics. He has done a lot of homework.
One can read the links on these pages. I just logged the highlights that seem to be on topic.
Pictures of Ford Alts http://oldfuelinjection.com/?p=63
3G install http://oldfuelinjection.com/?p=75
Reg replacement http://oldfuelinjection.com/?p=72
3G Swap http://chrisb.users.superford.org/Bronc ... nator.html
Ryan’s products http://www.rjminjectiontech.com/collections/alternators
Compare his with other places that sell new alts for in the $600+ region.
Why 200a http://www.rjminjectiontech.com/pages/200amp-alternator

[VintageIronFab]

Hello All,
My alternator is starting to crap out so I might as well make the 130 amp jump-- guessing the bracket will need a touch of clearancing. Is there an application that's best? It's a 96 with a 5.8 if that matters.

Thanks,
Matt

[Nick]

Hello All,
My alternator is starting to crap out so I might as well make the 130 amp jump-- guessing the bracket will need a touch of clearancing. Is there an application that's best? It's a 96 with a 5.8 if that matters.

Thanks,
Matt

Matt, I have on that I never used. $100 plus the ride if you want it.

[CPT. SPRINGINGTON]

93-96 V8 Econoline with Air Conditioning or the High Output Alternator options
97-03 V6 Econoline E-Series or F-150
95-01 4.0 V6 Explorer or Ranger

http://fullsizebronco.com/forum/showthread.php?t=55169

[VintageIronFab]

Thanks nick but I'm gonna try and get one locally,

Thanks for the info and the link,

On a side note I was/am a paying member over there on FSB and man that is a terrible forum -- those moderators are just these nazi a-holes like no other, GFB is just a great forum to belong to and such a blessing!

[ChaseTruck754]

On a side note I was/am a paying member over there on FSB and man that is a terrible forum -- those moderators are just these nazi a-holes like no other, GFB is just a great forum to belong to and such a blessing!

There seem to have been quite a few reasons GFB was started, but what you mention above did play a small part I'm sure.

[baja-chris]

Is there any reason why it's a bad idea to have a local shop rewind a stock alternator for more output?

[FUFIMI]

I bought mine from these guys: http://www.rjminjectiontech.com/collections/alternators
Great product and great customer service . I bought the 160 amp 3G for my bronco that I had.

[FUFIMI]

If you buy nick's alternator the website I posted, also sell the 3G harness and battery cable to make it an easier install.

[Nick]

I bought mine from these guys: http://www.rjminjectiontech.com/collections/alternators
Great product and great customer service . I bought the 160 amp 3G for my bronco that I had.

That's who I got mine from.

[RyanDS650X]

Hello All,
My alternator is starting to crap out so I might as well make the 130 amp jump-- guessing the bracket will need a touch of clearancing. Is there an application that's best? It's a 96 with a 5.8 if that matters.

Thanks,
Matt

Matt, I have on that I never used. $100 plus the ride if you want it.

Hey Nick, does that alt come with the harness and cable? If so id be interested in it. Im sure it would fit in a flat rate USPS box right?? Lemme know and congrats on the start of the F1fiddy build!