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at 10% street use and even less time than that of it being on the freeway, wouldn't you just live with what you have and stop throwing $$ at it? "Affordable" and overdrive usually don't go together.

Like any of us have stopped throwing money at our toys. Affordable is also relative. My first new quad in 1991 was a Yamaha Banshee $6000. A year later I got my Bronco for $5000. Now I have a set of front custom and rear bench seats costing up around $1500. So to spend the extra money to get a relatively cheap upgrade would be nice. If the answer was a 20k transmission, now that is not affordable.

Most likely I will keep the C6 but I just wanted to see if anyone had a fresh idea.

drewbee88 wrote:

philofab wrote:

Wrightracing.net wrote:So what is the strongest affordable overdrive transmission that can be bolted to a
351W and a NP205 transfer case?

M5R2 or ZF5 is the strongest. Also, these are shorter than an E4OD.

E4OD with the correct 4R100 parts is super strong too but requires some complicated electronics to control.

4L80/4L85 is very strong too and can be run without electronics if you don't mind manual control. Adapters to put it in will be $$$.

I love the 4l80 as they are very strong. Expensive to put behind a ford motor though. For the price of adapters would cost you could probably do a whole lq9 or lq4 motor swap with 4l80 mated to it.

I am seriously thinking of doing a 4L80E conversion when rebuild time comes. Hughes and others have the bellhousings removable on these for an additional $700 or so. I was thinking of going full manual valve body for reliability and so it will shift when I want it to. The tranny is around $2300, so you can get the whole set up for around $3k. Is a good E4OD rebuild near that same $3K? I would still be paying more for a transfer case adapter, etc. Also, I am not aware of any 4L80 to BW1356 adapters. Anyone know of one? I just figured that I would go full baller and go for a nice short Atlas at 12" long. That should free up some drive shaft real-estate.

Can someone talk me out of this?

The pros I can think of are...
Reliability (strength and lack of electronics)
Overdrive while being shorter than factory E4OD/1356
If my dream ever comes true to swap in a LSX, all I would have to do is changed the bell housing
And lastly, it’s just different and cool lol. Sacrilegious maybe, but I can care less about that.

The cons…
Twice the cost of E4OD rebuild, after all said and done?

Am I missing anything? I am no expert at this stuff, so please share your thoughts.

From my research full build e4od $3300ish. Minus 300m input/output little over $2k. That will be the route I will go as I don't plan on ever getting to crazy with the motor.

The setup your talking seems like your spending a ton of extra cash for minimal gain

Baja wrote: I am seriously thinking of doing a 4L80E conversion when rebuild time comes. Hughes and others have the bellhousings removable on these for an additional $700 or so. I was thinking of going full manual valve body for reliability and so it will shift when I want it to. The tranny is around $2300, so you can get the whole set up for around $3k. Is a good E4OD rebuild near that same $3K? I would still be paying more for a transfer case adapter, etc. Also, I am not aware of any 4L80 to BW1356 adapters. Anyone know of one? I just figured that I would go full baller and go for a nice short Atlas at 12" long. That should free up some drive shaft real-estate.

Can someone talk me out of this?

The pros I can think of are...
Reliability (strength and lack of electronics)
Overdrive while being shorter than factory E4OD/1356
If my dream ever comes true to swap in a LSX, all I would have to do is changed the bell housing
And lastly, it’s just different and cool lol. Sacrilegious maybe, but I can care less about that.

The cons…
Twice the cost of E4OD rebuild, after all said and done?

Am I missing anything? I am no expert at this stuff, so please share your thoughts.

To run an Ultra bell you cut off the factory bell. Some people report minor leaks from the front pump. Michael Cox had a custom output machined to made his to a 1356. The 4L80 will still have electronic shift solenoids, you will be running a jumper so the shift solenoids engage from the shift arm position. I believe line pressure is set regardless of throttle position with these setups, so expect very firm shifts.

I don't really see the point unless you go to an LS based motor too. I plan on running a 4L80, but that is only because finding a strong manual trans with a 4wd style output is ungodly expensive for a Chevy and I want big power for cheap from a 6.0 or 6.2. I plan on running an Atlas t-case... not wasting time on the 1356 setup.

I am not apposed to a 408 conversion, but I have heard of issues also with the bell housing cutting. Also, I am not a fan of the electronic solenoid setup. I know I am old school. I can rebuild and repair a C6, turbo 400 and AOD without computer diagnostics.

Here is my last go with the AOD after smoking the reverse clutches pulling a Van out of the dunes at Pismo. The guy had the parking brake on. A** H***. We still played in the dunes for two days with no reverse. I just learned to drive better and not need reverse.

The Allison specification torque converter worked well. With my plan to do a 408 stroker motor, the AOD may not cut it. Did ford ever put the AOD on a 460ci motor. I don't ever recall seeing one.

Typo: not apposed to a 4L80

The AOD is a light duty trans. The 460 only had C6 and E4OD automatic transmissions and a range of manuals.

Ya, that is what I thought.

Im in a similar situation. C6, 35s, 4:56s.
Street to dirt is about 50/50 but 80-90% of street is freeway while driving 800 miles round trip to/from Ensenada, SF etc. Not a dailey driver, race weeks only.

I can do about 63mph at 3000 RPM and it fucking sucks driving that far on the freeway at that speed.

Was looking to do a E4OD and maybe go to 4.11s unless there is a better option out there

If I were doing it from scratch I'd use a Ford SBF to Chevy adapter and run a 4L80. The 4L80 is shorter, cheaper, and can be run without electronics fully manual.

Easy upgrade to a LS based motor down the road too.

I should add, instead of retaining the 208 or 1356 T-case I would go to a 205 or Atlas. Once again, shorter, and also stronger.

Running a 1356 on a 4L80 would require a special output shaft that SmartAlex had made.

you know anything about mating up the 205 to the 4L80E Philo? I know 205's bolted to TH400's and that the 4L80E is a bit of a "newer 400" so maybe the tailhousing bolt pattern is the same from TH400 and 4L80 is the same? spline count and diameter of the tail shaft then becomes the next question.

ChaseTruck754 wrote:you know anything about mating up the 205 to the 4L80E Philo? I know 205's bolted to TH400's and that the 4L80E is a bit of a "newer 400" so maybe the tailhousing bolt pattern is the same from TH400 and 4L80 is the same? spline count and diameter of the tail shaft then becomes the next question.

The pattern is the same and clocked the same. Ford uses the same pattern but clocked aprox 30 degrees differently.

The 205 to 4L80 can be done many ways, depending on what 205 input you use. It came factory on early 90s (old body style) 3/4 and 1 ton Chevys connected to the 4L80. That adapter is hard to find I'm told.

The parts for the t-case adapter can be bought unwelded from many vendors, which is probably what I would do. The 205 is heavy and I plan on having Danzio build my motor at one point so a stout transmission mount will be a must. I'm hoping for 450+ WHP.

An added bonus of the late model GM 205 is that it had a VSS and also a switch for the 4wd dash lights...

I should mention you need to build a hybrid to get the driver drop on the case. Ford was the only case this way. GM and Dodge were passenger.

Another option is the 241C transfer case as it is a driver drop. I don't know much about these other that I've heard they can have oil problems.

philofab wrote:I should mention you need to build a hybrid to get the driver drop on the case. Ford was the only case this way. GM and Dodge were passenger.

Another option is the 241C transfer case as it is a driver drop. I don't know much about these other that I've heard they can have oil problems.

I believe the Borg warner 4401 was driver drop and fixed yokes for later year Chevy 3/4 ton and 1 tons. Making it easily available and no mods. Except for drivelines. I think 205 would be stronger in long run. But 4401 is an option as well

drewbee88 wrote:

philofab wrote:I should mention you need to build a hybrid to get the driver drop on the case. Ford was the only case this way. GM and Dodge were passenger.

Another option is the 241C transfer case as it is a driver drop. I don't know much about these other that I've heard they can have oil problems.

I believe the Borg warner 4401 was driver drop and fixed yokes for later year Chevy 3/4 ton and 1 tons. Making it easily available and no mods. Except for drivelines. I think 205 would be stronger in long run. But 4401 is an option as well

Look into the newer 4l80 its trucks they are all drivers drop cases

The 4408 has a vss in it as well as 1410 rear yoke

My issue is length more than strength. I need as long of driveline as possible in the rear.

philofab wrote:My issue is length more than strength. I need as long of driveline as possible in the rear.

Just stretch your bronco to whatever drive line length you want!