Giant's drop down brackets w/ coilovers getting 18"

kylesgorter · Post by **kylesgorter** » Sun Feb 19, 2012 11:08 am

After having worked with geoff on two projects in sourcing parts and services from giant here's my 2 cents:

Offtopic:
Geoff= good guy but its not that his ideas are off the wall hes kind of off the wall a bit and then back again on a lot of things. his products really are more the product of trial and error, his personal experience as well as what works for him from a buisness standpoint. But hes done a lot more error than trial and modifying a bad design to work better rather than a new design alltogether seems to be his forte....

On Topic:
I am not a big fan of the Giant drop down brackets from a standpoint of asthetics (i think they are ugly) as well as performance. For a given amount of gianed rideheight you would want the geometry of the steering vs. suspension to at least stay realatively close to stock or better. droping the pivot points makes the geometry and thus handling worse. Cutting and turning the beam for the same ride height increase but keeping the suspension and steering pivots the same will net improved geometry as the driver side tie rod extends a bit and the passenger draglink is already in a somewhat decent location.

As for travel and groundclearance, with worse geometry i dont think id want 18in of travel because at that much extension the handling could get scarry or get you into a rougher section than your arms will want to deal with. Ground clearance at the center of the truck is a major factor offroad in a lot of conditions. in the desert you do not want to be dragging your truck on the center in soft or hard two track. Soft you might bury it, hard with rocks you will prob have broken parts quick. I definitely dont like the idea of dropping the pitman arm position for the steering to be a bit better with the brackets as it lowers it down into the problem zone.

As for logistics, the drop down bracket is a good idea though on lighter duty vehicles with less travel like say simple stock lifted vehicles that might see some offroad. The drop bracket helps keep coils happier longer, balljoints, u-joints, etc all are in factory spec which is ideal for long life and dependability and is a simple system thats removable if need be. I just wanted to make a note of this because I do like drop down kits on the proper application and they can give many many years of good service.

For the best bang for the buck setup I think mkeifer's kit offering with the bolt-on coilover mounts is awesome. I havent dealt with him directly but Ive heard good things

economig · Post by **economig** » Mon Feb 20, 2012 2:20 am

Oh no, Giant offers a lot of options for different styles and approaches... That sounds horrible.

pretty sure they offer a lot of standard, proven stuff too

AussieRod · Post by **AussieRod** » Mon Feb 20, 2012 4:33 am

Like I wrote in another post: Moccha or Espesso? For some, drop brackets work, for others, C&T. Choose what works for your build. For me, drop brackets are the only LEGAL alternative. However, legalities are not my priority. Making the front suspension work for me is. With the law cracking down on lift heights, suspension mods, etc, its getting harder here to build a good rig. For the most part, the cops leave us alone, however, getting insurance is the biggest problem. Whats clear to me is I live in the wrong country.

Having said that, C&T is a great way to get the job done, but if you go with monoballs in the beam pivots, reinforce the factory pivot mounts. I know I am a dumbshit when it comes to this stuff, but I have seen both in action, and both work. I am learning well, and clearly both methods work when properly executed.

only1mikey · Post by **only1mikey** » Thu Feb 23, 2012 2:11 am

I ran GIANT suspension of my old race truck.

NEVER have a suspension failure

If Geoff released a product for sale, I would trust it on my ride. Even dun dun dunnnnnn drop brackets.

Mike

AussieRod · Post by **AussieRod** » Thu Feb 23, 2012 2:58 am

Mike, thats some awesome air!

economig · Post by **economig** » Thu Feb 23, 2012 8:01 am

only1mikey wrote:I ran GIANT suspension of my old race truck.

Mike

Dude! Those are some sick-pics! I liked the first one, third one (massive earth scoop rebound) and last one the best. Can't remember if i saw em before on DR or somewhere but those are cool

Unrelated to Mike's pics, something i've noticed at races or just dez trips over the years: Stuff that shouldn't break does sometimes. Stuff that'll never work goes the distance & lasts a hundred trips or even lands on the box every once in awhile... it's annoying when people attack good builders without knowing all the factors involved. Giant's got options, i think it's cool. They've got race proven components too. There's a lot of e-attacks on other builders recently too, who have SEVERAL score / bitd 1st place podiums in different classes. Seems TT's break more often than Broncos crack if we were gonna stat it

philofab · Post by **philofab** » Thu Feb 23, 2012 9:35 am

Mikey, we all know those are photoshopped. Everything would have broken in half or three pieces.

I was talking to Geoff the other day about the swap meet and mentioned this thread. He said no internet forum is going to stop him from enjoying his Bronco or keep it from working well. Additionally he said he had no ground clearance issues running around Barstow and KOH.

CITYRAT · Post by **CITYRAT** » Thu Feb 23, 2012 10:13 am

Holeeeeeeeshit that some air....Great shots mikey...Back to ths subject at hand. Ive known Geoff personally for close to 20 yrs.(Dam its been that long) Kylegorter comments are correct about him being alittle "off the wall". But thats what makes him Giant Geoff. I think he was the first to bring the "WIY" kits. He also took small time local racers from across so-cal sponsored them and made them feel part of a factory team..Pit support,tons of free goodies,webpage with team members... He has definatly had many set backs when it comes to design and build, but that just comes along with territory! Especially when you start to thinkn outside the box. His products have come a long way since the begining. But as mikeys pics show they are race proven!... Geoff has always been a good guy and good friend and has done alot for the desert race community. Love him or hate on him, it dont really matter he will continue to be "aliitle off the wall"!..But then again thats just my 2cents.

ogre20012001 · Post by **ogre20012001** » Thu Feb 23, 2012 6:29 pm

all things said. i run drop brakets now and will probably continue to do so. i have thought about doing a c&t but i am only running 3" of lift and my drop brackets work good for me. and i have about 15" of travel now. i like the design of the drop brakets in this thread and would buy them if i had the chance.

Nick · Post by **Nick** » Thu Feb 23, 2012 7:17 pm

ogre20012001 wrote:all things said. i run drop brakets now and will probably continue to do so. i have thought about doing a c&t but i am only running 3" of lift and my drop brackets work good for me. and i have about 15" of travel now. i like the design of the drop brakets in this thread and would buy them if i had the chance.

Truth be told, i think a drop down kit would work for most people. How many trucks raced with Rancho drop down brackets back in the day? If anyone is going to push the limits of speed in rough terrain, then drop down brackets should be the least of their worries! I would think that roll over protection would be the first concern.

I dig that Geoff does whacky stuff! It's whacky stuff that eventually turns into something innovative.

AussieRod · Post by **AussieRod** » Thu Feb 23, 2012 11:48 pm

Nick wrote:
ogre20012001 wrote:all things said. i run drop brakets now and will probably continue to do so. i have thought about doing a c&t but i am only running 3" of lift and my drop brackets work good for me. and i have about 15" of travel now. i like the design of the drop brakets in this thread and would buy them if i had the chance.
Truth be told, i think a drop down kit would work for most people. How many trucks raced with Rancho drop down brackets back in the day? If anyone is going to push the limits of speed in rough terrain, then drop down brackets should be the least of their worries! I would think that roll over protection would be the first concern.

I dig that Geoff does whacky stuff! It's whacky stuff that eventually turns into something innovative.

I agreee, Nick. rollover protection should be the first concern, not whether drop downs or C&T is better or worse. The main problem I see with drop downs is the extra load on the steering box sector shaft. Maybe an upgrade to the bigger Saginaw box should be considered a mandatory upgrade if one insists on drop brackets

ogre20012001 · Post by **ogre20012001** » Sat Feb 25, 2012 11:13 pm

AusBroncodoc wrote:
Nick wrote:
ogre20012001 wrote:all things said. i run drop brakets now and will probably continue to do so. i have thought about doing a c&t but i am only running 3" of lift and my drop brackets work good for me. and i have about 15" of travel now. i like the design of the drop brakets in this thread and would buy them if i had the chance.
Truth be told, i think a drop down kit would work for most people. How many trucks raced with Rancho drop down brackets back in the day? If anyone is going to push the limits of speed in rough terrain, then drop down brackets should be the least of their worries! I would think that roll over protection would be the first concern.

I dig that Geoff does whacky stuff! It's whacky stuff that eventually turns into something innovative.
I agreee, Nick. rollover protection should be the first concern, not whether drop downs or C&T is better or worse. The main problem I see with drop downs is the extra load on the steering box sector shaft. Maybe an upgrade to the bigger Saginaw box should be considered a mandatory upgrade if one insists on drop brackets

i will admit i am new to all this stuff, but not to off-roading. i can see the benifits of C&T but you still have ground clearince issues at the rear axle. now im not saying to not C&T or anything like that becouls i have been toying with the idea, but im also happy with the way mine preforms and it does what i need it to do and want it to do as of right now.

i agree on the roll over protection being high on the to do list. i still need a roll bar in mine. when you have kids in the back you think of that more often. its always in the back of my mind anyway.

im not trying to make anyone mad here so please just take my point of view as that my point of view, and that i support the drop brakets in this tread and may just call Giant on them and see how much they are.

ESHALLBETTER · Post by **ESHALLBETTER** » Sun Feb 26, 2012 2:11 am

Isn't any discussion about making TTB work a discussion about polishing a turd?

Shes not pretty but she puts out.

AussieRod · Post by **AussieRod** » Sun Feb 26, 2012 2:46 am

ESHALLBETTER wrote:Isn't any discussion about making TTB work a discussion about polishing a turd?

Shes not pretty but she puts out.

The haters can spin all the sh*t they want about how bad the TTB is, but when it comes to the rough stuff, the TTB will leave almost every straight axle or 4WD IFS choking in its dust. Having said that, the Moss Bros Bronco is a classic example of understanding the shortcomings of the straight axle in the desert and making the whole package do the job. She might not be the prettiest, or the ugliest hooker, but she knows how to achieve the result with a minimum of work

Agui-E7TE · Post by **Agui-E7TE** » Wed Feb 29, 2012 11:08 am

It's funny how most guys who swap to a straight axle and junk their TTB seem to think TTB is worthless because it wouldn't handle 40's and a heavy foot. The funny thing is that most solid axle swap broncos couldn't pass a class 11 bug in a mildly rough section of dirt. It seems to me these guys only run mud and their choice of tires lies between a Bogger or a Swamper TSL in the 40 inch and up range.

TTB just flat out works in the rough stuff! The Moss Bros. Bronco is definetly bad ass! I only hope my '79 can perform like that when I'm done building it.

TurboJoe · Post by **TurboJoe** » Sun Dec 23, 2012 1:57 am

I have the Giant drop brackets and radius arms and I am very happy with it, I'm not worried about breaking it after talking with Geoff about how he beats on his ( 3 laps at Barstow and a weekend in baja ) and his only failure was the stock beam pivot bushing's ( the drop brackets are set up with a spacer to work with stock beams or you can knock the spacer out when you upgrade to uniballs ) Very well built , The pivot with the tube crossmember is very heavy 1" 3/4 .188 wall DOM...

Joe