Steering Systems - Stock, Superunner & Equal Len. Crossover

[philofab]

If flipping the TRE to the top will induce BumpStr.
Would this offset TRE do basically the same thing?

Oh, and thanks for tolerating my dumb questions.

No, the pivot remains in the same location. The shape between pivots does not matter as long as it is sufficently strong and rigid.

[Dust]

If flipping the TRE to the top will induce BumpStr.
Would this offset TRE do basically the same thing?

Oh, and thanks for tolerating my dumb questions.

No, the pivot remains in the same location. The shape between pivots does not matter as long as it is sufficently strong and rigid.

Good Point!

Thanks!

[SteveG]

Second-- coming from an Early Bronco background modifiying the steering joints is totally normal- whether that be a GM 1-ton design to a rod end-- do people with the FSB do this mod or are the bronco/f150 ends perfectly fine. What about putting the joints on top of the knuckles for more clearance, and decreased working angles.

Putting the tie rod ends on top of the steering knuckle changes the steering geometry. You can move them but you'll need to relocate the inner pivots as well to compensate. Southwest performance does this on their swingset systems but that's with a completely new steering system.

Banged up tie rod ends doesn't seem to be a huge issue anyway.

[shockseals.com]

Out testing shocks friday I bent the ambulance drag link...with that said I would recommend building one from scratch or sleeving the stock one with chromoly. I will replace with another ambulnace one for now but something better will be in the works.

[philofab]

Out testing shocks friday I bent the ambulance drag link...with that said I would recommend building one from scratch or sleeving the stock one with chromoly. I will replace with another ambulnace one for now but something better will be in the works.

Where and how did it bend? Do you have pictures? My crew cab with 37s has never bent one of those even when I tacoed a radius arm and cracked the frame!

[shockseals.com]

It bent at the bend. If you layed it on a flat surface as new it probably had an inch rise at the highest part...now it probably has a 3 inch rise.

It bent doing some shock testing in whoops. They went out of sync so it dropped the nose in a hole and bottomed then popped the front up and wheeleid for a ways. Didnt bottom all that hard, didnt land hard and I never even slowed down thinking it was nothing. Throughout the day prior I hammered it way harder through some shit that was just way too big for the truck and nothing bent or was hurt.

Shit happens.

I thought for sure it would bend in two track when the driver side would bottom/stuff and the right side couldnt just turn since it was in a track but we did that several times during testing (unitentionally) and nothing happened.

[Copykat]

Good info. I'll add a bit into this for the Explorer/B2/ranger guys.

The 91-94 2wd Explorer uses a thicker steering linkage setup that is also bent. Installed one on a buddies ranger and it works great. I had picked up new set (About $300 for all) and installed it, but the bump steer was worse than with my current superrunner. I've switched back to the superrunner. When i do the D44 swap I plan to use the stock Explorer linkage I picked up and just extend the adjusters.

[sydude]

Hiya guys- I've ironed out the major bump-steer problem I was having with my Superunner steering (I had a very loose drop bracket, doh!), but I'm still left with big toe changes as the suspension cycles up and down. I haven't had the opportunity to swap in the stock steering as you guys recommended, and as I'm a stubborn SOB, I want to see if I can make what I've got work really well first.

So here's my idea, which looks pretty simple and nearly free - please let me know if you think it will work, what kind of changes or tweaks would be necessary, or if I'm just a dumb-ass to think about doing this:

The Superunner system looks to me to nearly the same concept as the Single Swing systems I've seen elsewhere, except it has short steering links that meet at nearly the same point, and not long/equal length rods that cross-over. So why not just move the link locations so they cross-over and put in equal length rods? It would be easy to do so - just:

1. Cut out the brackets and re-weld them in the new locations;
2. Reverse the passenger's side bracket, and then offset both brackets slightly fore and aft (longitudinally in relation to the car) to avoid one rod hitting the other's castle nut or rod end; and
3. Extend the existing rods by cutting, splicing in extensions and then sleeving & welding them.

Here's a pic of the existing configuration:

Original Superunner Steering

IMG_4651-Original.jpg (80.25 KiB) Viewed 5195 times

Here's a pic of the configuration as modified:

Superunner Single Swing / Crossover Mod

SuperunnerSingleSwing.jpg (129.46 KiB) Viewed 5195 times

Thanks, Sy

[Copykat]

The points would need to be moved further out.

Just from looking at it and what I know of TTB's is that the block in the center needs to be dropped down about 1.5-2" in your case. For best results when using bracket lift kits is that the links should be about as flat as you can get them. In the case of cut and turn beams this doesn't apply as much.

If your going to modify the link I would first start with dropping the center block.

Looking at the TTB geometry a single swing setup will not work well with the drop bracket kits becasue the length of the arm would have to be stupid long to get the correct geometry that minimises bump steer. Cut and turn beams work well with the single swing setup and stock pivot brackets.

On my Bronco II I dropped my center block down 2" and it now puts my links nearly flat and this has proven to give the best street manners. I have tried a stock linkage with the drop arm and it wasn't plesent to drive.

Good info in this article.
http://www.therangerstation.com/Magazin ... g_tech.htm

[philofab]

Pivot points for steering are best located by keeping them in line with the beam and radius arm pivot. I will try and draw a picture later.

[BDKW1]

While the geometry in the second pic would be way better than what you currently have, Actually getting everything to clear when you cycle it is almost imposable.

[philofab]

Kritter never took pics of his bent steering so I bent mine.

[SteveG]

Have you checked to make sure the steering isn't binding? Kris bent his the same way (twice). I think it might have been due to the suspension being allowed to droop too far (with stock steering)

How to check:
Remove the coils.
Raise the vehicle so both wheels are completely drooped (with limit straps installed).
Cycle one wheel up while the other is completely drooped. If the opposite wheel moves vertically, there is bind.
Do the same with the other wheel.
Limit droop accordingly to eliminate bind.

[shockseals.com]

Mine didnt bind. I noticed when I straightened and sleeved the ambulance drag link the material was fairly soft and easy to work with. Now bondo bob has the upgraded version that is chromoly sleeved and tig welded. Should be good to go now.

I have 1 more ambulance drag link without the adjuster or TRE that I will straighten and sleeve with chromo for $100 if anybody is interested.

I did send pics to steve, if he saved them he can post them. Mine bend on full compression both times and my bump is limited with a 1" spacer under the bump stop.

[philofab]

Mine bend on full compression both times and my bump is limited with a 1" spacer under the bump stop.

I will check for bind but I'm pretty sure I bent it next to the railroad tracks when I attempted to float over the top at 55 mph. I got kicked out of a hole and landed mostly on the right front tire.

[sydude]

Ok, quick update on my steering - I just put on a new set of stock steering components in instead of the superunner stuff, and it's made a world of difference, a hundred times better. And that's with a driveway alignment only so far, too. Thanks, guys, you are the best.

[funinthesun95]

Ok guys need some feedback on this set up. Not a fan of the drop down steering arm but it works well on this TTB set up.

Looks Like they are using a custom or drop down beam mounts as well. This would make sense why the drop down steering arm.

[philofab]

I'm not one for nylocks on steering. Castle nuts with cotter pins are my choice.

The drag link needs to be bent so all three pivots are exactly in line, if they aren't you will get some play in the tow in/out.

[funinthesun95]

I'm not one for nylocks on steering. Castle nuts with cotter pins are my choice.

The drag link needs to be bent so all three pivots are exactly in line, if they aren't you will get some play in the tow in/out.

Thanks Philo for the feed back I agree with the castle nuts and cotter pins

I will look for some pics of the drag link with bends so we can compare them. do you think they did not bend the drag link due to the drop downs? it looks like in the one pic the steering hits the steering box or frame at full bump?
This is new to me so it maybe a dumb question. sorry

The more I thing about it more single swinger maybe the way to go. But I like the stock look

[SteveG]

I don't see the advantage of building custom tie-rod ends that simply replace stock. If your geometry is good, the stock steering holds up pretty well. If you wanted to increase strength, you could sleeve the stock stuff.