Looking for your suggestions as I build a no budget racer
Looking for your suggestions as I build a no budget racer
For the last few years I've been racing the Nor Cal rock racing and VORRA series in the pre runner class in a loaner. Nothing special, it's a Jeep Wagoneer with a CJ7 body bolted to it and a nice shock package. With a rule change coming for 2017 I need to get my bronco done and grandfather'd into the glass for the last race 9/24.
My friends and I put a $1500 max on the rigs in our class as there is no purse, just bragging rights.
It's just a 1989 bronco, 351, C6, manual shift t case, 33x9x50 baja's in the front, 33x12/50 BFG MT's in the back
THe rear suspension, will remain mostly stock, just adding longer "White box" shocks, to the cage section, as I don't think there is much I can do there to gain travel.
THe front end, I'm putting on Wild Horses 2" lift coils, that should give the full size about 1/2" of lift, but mainly give it a better coil spring.
For front end shocks, who knows, that coil tower is massive and in the way, I wish I didn't just junk my coil towers from the early bronco.
Radius arms, build ones with Heims would be nice, but I just extend the ones I have and use the stock bushing, my experince has never let me to belive the bushing was the binding point. To save time, extexing the ones I already have makes a lot less fab work, they'd just be ugly.
Any other thoughts?
Last night started the gutting, I will also be removing the rear floor from behind the drivers seat rearward, and removing the inner wall of sheet metal from the rear 1/4s, and adding a simple tie in to hold the pannels from flopping in the wind.
I needed to weld the tubes to the 8.8 and make a truss.
Add fuel cell.
Make bumper for the back, something lighter up front.
I've taken a good amount of the weight off it, do I need to truss the front end? I left a voicemail with Threat to see if he had a plate kit for a stock TTB.
Cut and turn would be nice, not going to happen in this time frame.
I've like to find some lift drop brackets to give this truck some negative camber, but I've not found any yet.
Anyway, I'd love to hear your thoughts on how to improve this as I've been out of the TTB game for a long time.
The long term goal is to put a Jeep YJ body or EB tub on it.
My friends and I put a $1500 max on the rigs in our class as there is no purse, just bragging rights.
It's just a 1989 bronco, 351, C6, manual shift t case, 33x9x50 baja's in the front, 33x12/50 BFG MT's in the back
THe rear suspension, will remain mostly stock, just adding longer "White box" shocks, to the cage section, as I don't think there is much I can do there to gain travel.
THe front end, I'm putting on Wild Horses 2" lift coils, that should give the full size about 1/2" of lift, but mainly give it a better coil spring.
For front end shocks, who knows, that coil tower is massive and in the way, I wish I didn't just junk my coil towers from the early bronco.
Radius arms, build ones with Heims would be nice, but I just extend the ones I have and use the stock bushing, my experince has never let me to belive the bushing was the binding point. To save time, extexing the ones I already have makes a lot less fab work, they'd just be ugly.
Any other thoughts?
Last night started the gutting, I will also be removing the rear floor from behind the drivers seat rearward, and removing the inner wall of sheet metal from the rear 1/4s, and adding a simple tie in to hold the pannels from flopping in the wind.
I needed to weld the tubes to the 8.8 and make a truss.
Add fuel cell.
Make bumper for the back, something lighter up front.
I've taken a good amount of the weight off it, do I need to truss the front end? I left a voicemail with Threat to see if he had a plate kit for a stock TTB.
Cut and turn would be nice, not going to happen in this time frame.
I've like to find some lift drop brackets to give this truck some negative camber, but I've not found any yet.
Anyway, I'd love to hear your thoughts on how to improve this as I've been out of the TTB game for a long time.
The long term goal is to put a Jeep YJ body or EB tub on it.
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Re: Looking for your suggestions as I build a no budget racer
I'll add that the door are going back on, it's just easier to gut and build a cage with them gone.
- Tchajagos
- Posts: 2124
- Joined: Sat Dec 17, 2011 11:07 am
- Bronco Info: 1993 xlt stock on 33' BFGs
- Location: Murrieta
Looking for your suggestions as I build a no budget racer
What are in the rules? Cage, fuel cell, stock appearing? Stock suspension points? There are a number of things you can do to make this a nice racer but they all cost $$.
Re: Looking for your suggestions as I build a no budget racer
no suspension limits on in class, the only rules are safety related (cage, nets, cell, lights)
- Tchajagos
- Posts: 2124
- Joined: Sat Dec 17, 2011 11:07 am
- Bronco Info: 1993 xlt stock on 33' BFGs
- Location: Murrieta
Looking for your suggestions as I build a no budget racer
Don't even worry about suspension until you have all the safety regulated stuff. It all adds up $$$$. Stock suspension is pretty good if you run limit straps and bigger bump stops. Longer radius arms will help a lot. 33" tires will rub into the inner fenders on bump. You could get some fiberglass front fenders and make supports for all the under hood stuff. Are you going to remove the windshield? I would start small and build slowly as funds become available to you.
Re: Looking for your suggestions as I build a no budget racer
I have most of the safety equipment left over from other race cars, i just need new window nets
No more inner fenders up front, and now I'm at just panels in the back
I did not have have fancy shocks on my shelf, so Rancho 9000's it is.
No more inner fenders up front, and now I'm at just panels in the back
I did not have have fancy shocks on my shelf, so Rancho 9000's it is.
- Tchajagos
- Posts: 2124
- Joined: Sat Dec 17, 2011 11:07 am
- Bronco Info: 1993 xlt stock on 33' BFGs
- Location: Murrieta
Looking for your suggestions as I build a no budget racer
Wow. Nothing really left in there haha. How are you going to deal with the dust?
- Tchajagos
- Posts: 2124
- Joined: Sat Dec 17, 2011 11:07 am
- Bronco Info: 1993 xlt stock on 33' BFGs
- Location: Murrieta
Looking for your suggestions as I build a no budget racer
Spoil the rear and slap on a truss.
Here's a beefy one from ruff stuff for not a whole lot of money.
http://www.ruffstuffspecialties.com/cat ... xleTrusses
Limit straps and good bump stops will go a long way in making sure your suspension doesn't self destruct. A set of dialed in nice shocks will also let you gain some speed. Those factory sealed white rocket shocks don't last that long going fast for extended periods. One the oil heats up and starts to foam they are pretty much useless.
Here's a beefy one from ruff stuff for not a whole lot of money.
http://www.ruffstuffspecialties.com/cat ... xleTrusses
Limit straps and good bump stops will go a long way in making sure your suspension doesn't self destruct. A set of dialed in nice shocks will also let you gain some speed. Those factory sealed white rocket shocks don't last that long going fast for extended periods. One the oil heats up and starts to foam they are pretty much useless.
- Tchajagos
- Posts: 2124
- Joined: Sat Dec 17, 2011 11:07 am
- Bronco Info: 1993 xlt stock on 33' BFGs
- Location: Murrieta
Looking for your suggestions as I build a no budget racer
Should be spool not spoil.
- AussieRod
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- Location: Downunder
Re: Looking for your suggestions as I build a no budget racer
That "truss" is like using an umbrella for brakes, sorry.Tchajagos wrote:Spoil the rear and slap on a truss.
Here's a beefy one from ruff stuff for not a whole lot of money.
http://www.ruffstuffspecialties.com/cat ... xleTrusses
There are better ways to truss a 8.8 correctly, UNDERNEATH the axle housing. The truss needs to be in tension, to prevent the tubes from pulling out and/or bending up at the cast housing.
- Tchajagos
- Posts: 2124
- Joined: Sat Dec 17, 2011 11:07 am
- Bronco Info: 1993 xlt stock on 33' BFGs
- Location: Murrieta
Looking for your suggestions as I build a no budget racer
Then weld it underneath. This is 1/4" plate. I've seen plenty of trusses that work welded all over the place on the axle. Yes tension works best from a structural engineering point especially if you want to use thinner materials more efficiently. This truss looks beefy enough to be welded on and then have the center section cut out and it would still be fine without bending.
This ruff stuff truss is not made to weld to the cast center section. In order for an under truss to use tension it would have to be welded to the center or resting on the center section.
I've seen some cool trusses welded to the back side where they used a ruff stuff diff cover (holy shit 3/8" thick plate) and made it bolt-in in the center.
http://www.ruffstuffspecialties.com/cat ... =ruffstuff
This ruff stuff truss is not made to weld to the cast center section. In order for an under truss to use tension it would have to be welded to the center or resting on the center section.
I've seen some cool trusses welded to the back side where they used a ruff stuff diff cover (holy shit 3/8" thick plate) and made it bolt-in in the center.
http://www.ruffstuffspecialties.com/cat ... =ruffstuff
- Tchajagos
- Posts: 2124
- Joined: Sat Dec 17, 2011 11:07 am
- Bronco Info: 1993 xlt stock on 33' BFGs
- Location: Murrieta
Looking for your suggestions as I build a no budget racer
But you are correct that underneath truss is ideal under tension when set up correctly.
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Re: Looking for your suggestions as I build a no budget racer
If you're running the VORRA short course stuff, 33's will be fine. After your safety equipment, invest in good shocks. Far and away they will make the most difference. Switch to 2.5" rear springs, a lot more bendy than the stockers. Might know where you can score some good used ones.
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Re: Looking for your suggestions as I build a no budget racer
Do a cable truss at the bottom with a heavy duty turn buckle. That way you can re-tension during prep. I personally would stay away from the "beefy" ruff stuff truss. I would put money on it that your axle tubes will still flex at case except now you have added another bend point vs just one where they come out of the casting. When I was younger in my teens we broke the crap out of 8.8 in our broncos because we could never afford big rear-ends. The best set up we did was a piece of 2" 4130 tube bent around the bottom of the diff end to end with pockets to get the u-bolts in and out as well as a couple tube kickers going from truss to axle tubes. We also welded tube to the casting and drilled and rosetted top and bottom. It was a ton of labor but never broke the 8.8 again and we used to think we were Robby Gordon in that beast. It had wabco cc860 coils with bilsteins up front and some re arched stockers that National spring gave us cause we grew up with the owners kids at the time in the rear with 5100 bilsteins. It worked unbelievably well until it got impounded for us being punk kids. As for Ranchos or any old school white shock set up it will work you don't have to spend 5-10k on shocks to go have fun. Think about how many years people raced on those set ups oh wait some still do at Norra and I can guarantee you some of those guys are having a better time then some of the guys that have 20k shock packages. I have a couple sets of the cc860 coils that are brand new. I will give you a set to help with your build they should give you about 2" of lift they are a progressive moog ambulance coil if you don't have coils already. Ill try to dig up an old picture of our truss we did if not ill sketch one up for you.
- Tchajagos
- Posts: 2124
- Joined: Sat Dec 17, 2011 11:07 am
- Bronco Info: 1993 xlt stock on 33' BFGs
- Location: Murrieta
Looking for your suggestions as I build a no budget racer
That's some great advice on the rear truss.
Re: Looking for your suggestions as I build a no budget racer
I do like cable trusses!
I was just going to make a truss on this one out of 1"x1" 1/8 wall square stock. It held up on my jeep pretty well, and it's quick and easy and the square die for my bender has only been used 3 times, I gotta get my monies worth on it!
I did weld the tubes of the rear axle and add more weld to the plug welds.
The roll cage is complete, The B hoop sits on top of the front spring hanger, the joins the frame there as well with a kicker, mainly to beef up that hanger and it was an easy spot to land the cage.
Front A posts land on the frame, you can see there are 2 dash bars, the center bar is for my shifter, the other bar goes to the frame.
The front bars go from the A hoop and land on top of the coil buckets.
I ended up scoring some dealer take off 14" travel fox 2.0 shocks, so it looks like I will have some rear shocks, the front is still white box shocks.
I am worried about the rear springs being too stiff, you can see how high it sits with all the weight removed, I might ended up taking the bottom leaf out of it, but it needs to get jumped first to find out.
2.5 inch springs sounds interesting, but I can't move that front hanger now, so I'd need to run spacers.
The fuel cell is in, and I hooked a battery to it and it still started and ran, so that made me happy that no one cut any important wires while gutting it.
There are 2" wheel spacers in the back, and 1.25's up front (what I had on the shelf), mainly to give it a more stable feeling in the corners. The rear fenders need to be trimmed as well, or the tires will do it for me.
I have the rear firewall in (some races require something between the fuel cell and the cab) but it's mainly to keep mud off of me.
The rear shocks mount off the top of the u bolt plate to the cage. I have 9" of up bump from ride height. (my last car had 12" TOTAL travel). I have no idea about down travel yet, I was only setting it up for full up travel.
I did trim about 1.5" off the rear bump stops as well. The factory bumps are too squishy, I'd rather have the shock do more work and have the bump stop be firm. After this season, a set of air bumps will go on, but as we are all sticking to $1500 cars, I did't want to put my $400 air bumps on it.
I was just going to make a truss on this one out of 1"x1" 1/8 wall square stock. It held up on my jeep pretty well, and it's quick and easy and the square die for my bender has only been used 3 times, I gotta get my monies worth on it!
I did weld the tubes of the rear axle and add more weld to the plug welds.
The roll cage is complete, The B hoop sits on top of the front spring hanger, the joins the frame there as well with a kicker, mainly to beef up that hanger and it was an easy spot to land the cage.
Front A posts land on the frame, you can see there are 2 dash bars, the center bar is for my shifter, the other bar goes to the frame.
The front bars go from the A hoop and land on top of the coil buckets.
I ended up scoring some dealer take off 14" travel fox 2.0 shocks, so it looks like I will have some rear shocks, the front is still white box shocks.
I am worried about the rear springs being too stiff, you can see how high it sits with all the weight removed, I might ended up taking the bottom leaf out of it, but it needs to get jumped first to find out.
2.5 inch springs sounds interesting, but I can't move that front hanger now, so I'd need to run spacers.
The fuel cell is in, and I hooked a battery to it and it still started and ran, so that made me happy that no one cut any important wires while gutting it.
There are 2" wheel spacers in the back, and 1.25's up front (what I had on the shelf), mainly to give it a more stable feeling in the corners. The rear fenders need to be trimmed as well, or the tires will do it for me.
I have the rear firewall in (some races require something between the fuel cell and the cab) but it's mainly to keep mud off of me.
The rear shocks mount off the top of the u bolt plate to the cage. I have 9" of up bump from ride height. (my last car had 12" TOTAL travel). I have no idea about down travel yet, I was only setting it up for full up travel.
I did trim about 1.5" off the rear bump stops as well. The factory bumps are too squishy, I'd rather have the shock do more work and have the bump stop be firm. After this season, a set of air bumps will go on, but as we are all sticking to $1500 cars, I did't want to put my $400 air bumps on it.
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- Tchajagos
- Posts: 2124
- Joined: Sat Dec 17, 2011 11:07 am
- Bronco Info: 1993 xlt stock on 33' BFGs
- Location: Murrieta
Looking for your suggestions as I build a no budget racer
That actually looks like it's going to be fun to drive!
Re: Looking for your suggestions as I build a no budget racer
Damn, I was hoping I'd take more pics, but I didnt.
The Race is on 9/24.
I built out extended Radius arms, but it's still held back by 2 Rancho 9000's up front.
I added a steering quickner.
It's been a constant battle every day after work, but I hope to be mostly done this weekend.
If so, I will head to the junk yard for a Saginaw pump as with the quickner, I don't think the ford C2 pump will live long.
The Race is on 9/24.
I built out extended Radius arms, but it's still held back by 2 Rancho 9000's up front.
I added a steering quickner.
It's been a constant battle every day after work, but I hope to be mostly done this weekend.
If so, I will head to the junk yard for a Saginaw pump as with the quickner, I don't think the ford C2 pump will live long.
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Re: Looking for your suggestions as I build a no budget racer
Those are Wild Horses Early Bronco coils on there, they were 2" lift coils and they gave me about 1/2" of lift. After the first lap, they should sag down to stock height.