Race radios

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PaulW
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Re: Race radios

Post by PaulW »

mesquito_creek wrote:Let me rephase the question: Just out of curiosity, is the BFG Relay 151.715 an open simplex 2 meter repeater? Or are they manning that station and verbally relaying to the receiving station? Seems it would get hammered with traffic if its a open simplex repeater...
=====
Cannot answer you radio lingo. But yes they are real people that talk on their on-site radios. There are 2 guys at the site in a high place with a tall antenna and a satellite link and several radios. Not sure how many antennas are at the site on a give race. I suspect extra radios are backup, but they have at least 2 in operation all the time.
Of course the sat setup has a couple of things like a dish and a receiver and a laptop. All supported with a bunch of gasoline and a generator and several batteries. Their place is an interesting place to visit.

The Check Points are pretty similar to BFG Relay setups except the checkpoint guys do not have a sat link.
All the above is for OLD SCORE --- Not NEW SCORE
I have no idea how NEW SCORE works.
Paul
mesquito_creek
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Re: Race radios

Post by mesquito_creek »

Thank you Paul... That clarifies the BFG relay as an actual manned relay, just like it says. My gaggle of trucks/bikes are HAMs, use a bunch of repeaters down there and monitor the race freqs. We have pretty solid coverage from San Felipe to Phx and San Diego.
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PaulW
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Re: Race radios

Post by PaulW »

We all have to deal with the nomenclature repeater or relay.

In San Felipe there is an effort to set up a repeater (unmanned) for emergency use following the guide lines of CERT in the US. We have the site and several VHF radios and are using the commercial band. The HAM guys are in charge. WE have 2 new freqs both are duplex?
CERT= Community Emergency Reediness Team
PW
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robertcrav
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Re: Race radios

Post by robertcrav »

Thoughts on a Motorola Spectra as a secondary/back up to the Maratrac?
mesquito_creek
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Re: Race radios

Post by mesquito_creek »

PaulW wrote:We all have to deal with the nomenclature repeater or relay.

In San Felipe there is an effort to set up a repeater (unmanned) for emergency use following the guide lines of CERT in the US. We have the site and several VHF radios and are using the commercial band. The HAM guys are in charge. WE have 2 new freqs both are duplex?
CERT= Community Emergency Reediness Team
PW
I am not familiar with duplex VHF commercial operation,... All the VHF (2 meter) repeaters I use are simplex split frequency. Transmit on one frequency and Receive on another. I will be down around SF this weekend, if you know what the frequencies are for your CERT repeater I will monitor/scan for it and let you know if I hear anything...
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philofab
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Re: Race radios

Post by philofab »

Duplex just allows two channels (freq) so someone can't walk on the dispatcher/base with an open mic. Most Fire/Police/Medical work this way.

Duplex is trickier to setup since you have two frequencies. It also doesn't allow you to talk to anyone but base/dispatch. Good for some things but not our use.
mesquito_creek
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Re: Race radios

Post by mesquito_creek »

I think the combination of the two frequencies you are talking about (TX/RX) on the repeater is what you are meaning by duplex. I think each leg of the transmission is a simplex operation but in a repeater that combined operation of simultaneous TX/RX is considered duplex. Not that is matters, but it will be cool to have a working "Race" repeater. Once you have been on repeaters, you will dig it... at the very least monitoring a repeater is more interesting..
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PaulW
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Re: Race radios

Post by PaulW »

I have been trying to stay out of the whole SF deal. Nothing on those SF freqs now days.
There are several commercial repeaters in use for law and various businesses in SF. All Spanish language. I just listen to the jabber at the repeater where they all have the speakers active in a lock box. Ha.
My security system I believe is UHF. But the same provider offers a 2 freq VHF (Tx on one freq & RX on another) repeater for the racers. Its a pay per race deal. He told me he wants to get the racers to go UHF for much better performance - range. That will be a lost cause since 99% of the racers are stuck with commercial VHF.

The biggest deal for CERT is to get all the radios reprogrammed for the 2 freqs regardless of which way they go. I think 90% of these guys do not even have the SW for their radios. I have no idea how they will work it out? I suspect they will give up and just go with the 2 freqs which both have Tx & Rx on the same freq.

Mempry fails and I have to look up such details as duplex and simplex. Sorry to lazy to keep looking it up.
PW
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Re: Race radios

Post by mesquito_creek »

PaulW wrote: He told me he wants to get the racers to go UHF for much better performance - range. That will be a lost cause since 99% of the racers are stuck with commercial VHF.
PW
That interesting? UHF "better performance"? ... I was always told UHF was better to go through structures/walls but shorter distances... VHF better over distance. I have both at my base station in mexico, and the VHF reaches out into the desert better to reach trucks at a distance... But on the UHF side cross band repeat to handhelds is the bomb...
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PaulW
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Re: Race radios

Post by PaulW »

mesquito_creek wrote:
PaulW wrote: He told me he wants to get the racers to go UHF for much better performance - range. That will be a lost cause since 99% of the racers are stuck with commercial VHF.
PW
That interesting? UHF "better performance"? ... I was always told UHF was better to go through structures/walls but shorter distances... VHF better over distance. I have both at my base station in mexico, and the VHF reaches out into the desert better to reach trucks at a distance... But on the UHF side cross band repeat to handhelds is the bomb...
=======
Apparently his new fangled digital setup has better range. He can talk to the guys at the mine from down town via he repeater on the 5000+' mountain. Using the older VHF setup for the racers the distance is limited to Hwy3. What he said.
PW
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PaulW
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Re: Race radios

Post by PaulW »

Next time you are in SF go discuss it with the owner. His base station is on the dump road. Look for the big antenna S of the road. First street to the left heading from the arches. He hangs out in a trailer on your right as you drive in. His full name is Edgard Sterling. His company is Del Desirto. Nice guy and will freely talk to you.
PW
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Re: Race radios

Post by mesquito_creek »

PaulW wrote: repeater on the 5000+' mountain.
PW
5000 ft will solve a lot if not all of your problems. Thanks for the information, I will hit that guy up...
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Re: Race radios

Post by Wrightracing.net »

PaulW wrote:David nice work.
Can you give us the details?
I put these pit box radios together for guys that do remote pits. A few years back I was doing a pit for JCR Team Honda down
past LA Bay for the 1000 and Honda gave us a pit radio that had been screwed to a piece of plywood. After a 50 miles on a ruff dirt road the radio was beat to death. It was in our pit captains truck, so not my fault. Fortunately I pulled out my 110 watt kenwood from my truck that worked great. We got lucky and got it all up and working about 10 minutes before our 1X bike and the helicopter. We did a 17 second fuel, water and bike check, then our guy was off to take 1st place.

After that race I started thinking of a better way to setup pit radios. I have been a sound engineer for 26 years and what came to mind was the equipment flight cases we use to transport rack mount sound gear. I picked up a rack mount shelf and mounted the radio and a antenna tuner to the rack shelf and put that in the flight case. Then what I did is mount a external speaker in the back cover. For power I picked up a 50ft, 10g extension cord like you use in the garage. I cut the 110v plugs off and combined the white and black wires to make it a 5g wire and used the green for ground. Then I put a Anderson winch plug on my F350 in front and rear, along with one on the extension cord to give me a direct connection to the batteries in the truck. At night we put the truck battery charger on the generator along with our light. Great setup

I have now made 11 of these pit box setups with a Kenwood 110 watt radios for teams.
If you have to haul a pit to a remote area, this is a great way to do it.
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1Hondalover
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Re: Race radios

Post by 1Hondalover »

As the accessory rewiring for Jim & Paige's Bronco begins to take shape on paper, I've begun to assess some of the existing components that came with it. The race radio is Kenwood TK-730H with what appears to be KCH-4 control head. While I look for PDF copy of the original installation instruction & owner's manual to make sure everything is as it should be, I'd like opinion of this equipment before I commit to it.

Wrightracing has had comment to the protection of the base unit in our build thread, and based on your other posts here you obviously know something about race radios in general. I'd appreciate your detailed comment here if there's anything pertinent. Should I contact the likes of PCI for their thoughts and/or advice on my Kenwood equipment?

Just want to make sure we don't have an unserviceable dinosaur in our new renovation.....
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Re: Race radios

Post by Wrightracing.net »

There is nothing wrong with running the TK730H. Tons of people are running them and they are almost bullet proof. I do repairs and refurbish radios for the guys at Solo MotorSports and a bunch of other teams. The main repairs are external stuff that gets trashed, do to poor installation and poor prep. The main radio units are solid, yet the weak link is the Molex connectors.

The guys at PCI are great, but they will of course recommend new radios, that is what they are there for, to make money.

For a piece of mind, you should check the radio out on a power meter for proper output. Also, the Molex power connector should be replaced with a Weather Pak connector. I would also recommend a RF noise suppressor on the radio. I like the Kenwood KLF-2 line suppressor. For the intercom, I replace that Molex connector with a metal mobile 5 pin connector like PCI uses on their race intercoms. On chase and pre-runner trucks I setup a second outside speaker so it can be used as a PA and then on the TK730H you can switch the radio audio outside, so you can leave the doors and windows shut while watching the race. When it comes to mounting the radio, the place should be away from heat sources like the passenger side under the seat, because of the exhaust and Cat. Also the trans tunnel gets hot and the firewall are not the best place. Under the drivers seat might work but depends on your Bronco. The best thing if you mount it on the floor is to use rubber mounts, like used for oil coolers. It keeps the radio off the ground in case you swamp the truck with water and lets the radio breath. The radios don't usually get hot, so it is not an issue.

On my Bronco, I am mounting the radio in a custom center console with layer of Dyno mat, to keep the heat out from the floor. Another place I have seen it mounted was to the cage on tabs on it's side behind the passenger door.

If you have any questions let me know.
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Re: Race radios

Post by Wrightracing.net »

Double post, ????? Maybe admin can delete the second post.
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Re: Race radios

Post by Wrightracing.net »

Thanks admin!!!!!!!
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Re: Race radios

Post by 1Hondalover »

Wrightracing.net wrote:There is nothing wrong with running the TK730H. Tons of people are running them and they are almost bullet proof. I do repairs and refurbish radios for the guys at Solo MotorSports and a bunch of other teams. The main repairs are external stuff that gets trashed, do to poor installation and poor prep. The main radio units are solid, yet the weak link is the Molex connectors.

The guys at PCI are great, but they will of course recommend new radios, that is what they are there for, to make money.

For a piece of mind, you should check the radio out on a power meter for proper output. Also, the Molex power connector should be replaced with a Weather Pak connector. I would also recommend a RF noise suppressor on the radio. I like the Kenwood KLF-2 line suppressor. For the intercom, I replace that Molex connector with a metal mobile 5 pin connector like PCI uses on their race intercoms. On chase and pre-runner trucks I setup a second outside speaker so it can be used as a PA and then on the TK730H you can switch the radio audio outside, so you can leave the doors and windows shut while watching the race. When it comes to mounting the radio, the place should be away from heat sources like the passenger side under the seat, because of the exhaust and Cat. Also the trans tunnel gets hot and the firewall are not the best place. Under the drivers seat might work but depends on your Bronco. The best thing if you mount it on the floor is to use rubber mounts, like used for oil coolers. It keeps the radio off the ground in case you swamp the truck with water and lets the radio breath. The radios don't usually get hot, so it is not an issue.

On my Bronco, I am mounting the radio in a custom center console with layer of Dyno mat, to keep the heat out from the floor. Another place I have seen it mounted was to the cage on tabs on it's side behind the passenger door.

If you have any questions let me know.
Makes me feel better already thank you. Not sure where you're at......maybe I need to pay you a visit for an "electrical checkup".

One question for the moment - does the mic have to be plugged into the remoted control face or can it be connected separately and remotely via the radio base? I'm considering mounting the face on the cage tube at the top of the windshield with the accessory switches, and I'd rather not have the spiral mic cord in my face.
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Re: Race radios

Post by Wrightracing.net »

Yes, it can be rewired to have a microphone connector on the base unit.

I sent you a PM.
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Re: Race radios

Post by tvoymang »

New race radio for the bronco....
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