Steering pump

Drew
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Steering pump

Post by Drew »

Is there an aftermarket steering pump that is better than stock. That's going to be my weakest point right now.
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PaulW
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Re: Steering pump

Post by PaulW »

Use Google Search. You will find more DIY links than you will imagine
What most of us use is a GM Saginaw conversion
There also some less used Delco conversions - not recommended.
Easiest is an E150 swap from the 90s. Get the bracket, pump, & Pulley, and proceed. Get the surf in hand and exchange the pump for a rebuilt Cardone at the auto store.
cs_drums
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Re: Steering pump

Post by cs_drums »

This was just a big topic. Lots of info-
http://www.gofastbroncos.com/forum/view ... =15&t=2891
Seabass
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Re: Steering pump

Post by Seabass »

Be cautious with the rebuit saginaw pumps. There are truck internals and car internals and alot of the reman companies only have one part number. Word on the Internet is that they only use car internals because its cheaper. May just be an internet rumor but it sounds plausible. Id recommend using west texas, psc, lee or howe for a pump rebuild. Im currently using a junkyard van saginaw pump with the pressure relief turned up and the flow restriction orifice opened up. So far so good.
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PaulW
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Re: Steering pump

Post by PaulW »

Cardone has an E150 specific pump which is what you want for a Bronco. And they have many other parts for sale for specific applications.
Cannot remember for sure, but I think it has the big shaft which is why I said to get the pulley. And the Bronco comes with the small shaft??
Somebody needs to confirm
Thanks, PW
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RyanDS650X
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Re: Steering pump

Post by RyanDS650X »

PaulW wrote:Cardone has an E150 specific pump which is what you want for a Bronco. And they have many other parts for sale for specific applications.
Cannot remember for sure, but I think it has the big shaft which is why I said to get the pulley. And the Bronco comes with the small shaft??
Somebody needs to confirm
Thanks, PW
Can anyone confirm the shaft size? Im heading to the yard today.
Seabass
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Re: Steering pump

Post by Seabass »

Sorry I read this too late. When I bought mine I just unbolted the bracket from the head and took it woth everthing attached. Pnp has raised their prices I think they wanted $10 per hose. I got new ones for 13 a piece at vato zone so id advise to not take those.

Hope you get this in time.

My next jy mission is to see if I can find a slightly smaller diameter 6 rib pulley to oget the r's up at idle on the pump
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RyanDS650X
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Re: Steering pump

Post by RyanDS650X »

thanks for the reply but I was unable to find a van I could use. ill go to a bigger yard next week and call ahead.
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Re: Steering pump

Post by shockseals.com »

Seabass wrote:Be cautious with the rebuit saginaw pumps. There are truck internals and car internals and alot of the reman companies only have one part number. Word on the Internet is that they only use car internals because its cheaper. May just be an internet rumor but it sounds plausible. Id recommend using west texas, psc, lee or howe for a pump rebuild. Im currently using a junkyard van saginaw pump with the pressure relief turned up and the flow restriction orifice opened up. So far so good.

I believe this is true after putting in a cardone E150 pump from rock auto. What size did you drill your orifice to? I went to #10 (.191). Are you running a ram? The orifice and piston assmebly is from the van JY pump...I have not yet measured the orifice and piston height in the reman pump as it is currently in the bronco.
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Re: Steering pump

Post by shockseals.com »

and to be clear, the reman cardone 207878 pump from rock auto is not adequate with my Tommy Lee set up, the C2 pump was much better that was modified by Lee but it always made noise and it had 8 years on the clock so i figured good time to swap while its getting a motor.
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Re: Steering pump

Post by shockseals.com »

much better now drilled to #10 and piston height reduced to minimum height.
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funinthesun95
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Re: Steering pump

Post by funinthesun95 »

I know it adds some cost but the TC pump has worked well on the bronco. I have had both Sag and TC on the black bronco. Solo mods the stock bracket now and sells.

I just used the Howe steel mod adapter plate $25-30 at the time.

again you will need TC pump, pulley, and adapter and figure out lines. It is not plug and play but not that hard.

This would be if you can not find the Van stuff that is more bolt on and go.

I can look for the PDF that shows you how to mod the bracket on Howe web page....
Good people + Great info = GFB
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Re: Steering pump

Post by shockseals.com »

funinthesun95 wrote:I know it adds some cost but the TC pump has worked well on the bronco. I have had both Sag and TC on the black bronco. Solo mods the stock bracket now and sells.

I just used the Howe steel mod adapter plate $25-30 at the time.

again you will need TC pump, pulley, and adapter and figure out lines. It is not plug and play but not that hard.

This would be if you can not find the Van stuff that is more bolt on and go.

I can look for the PDF that shows you how to mod the bracket on Howe web page....
I swapped not based on cost but based on P pump easy to get anywhere in baja and can be made to work as well as my Lee modified factory pump.

Is the TC pump available at any autoparts store? I thought it was race specific and required a remote resi, not just an easy grab at any vato zone in baja. If it is an OE replacement part whats the year/make/model to get one from so I can make note of that.

WIth the mod sag p pump if one ever fails, $35 at a local parts shop and swap the modified fitting and piston over and you are back in business was my only reason for swapping to the p pump. Mounting a remote resi was the second deal breaker after being able to source anywhere or I would have bought a complete race style set up from PSS or Howe.
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PaulW
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Re: Steering pump

Post by PaulW »

Shucks, I went thru all this more than once.
Yes, auto parts store replacement source is always good. And the van pump can be found there anywhere in Baja. And its fitting is removable. No dual return line.
I drove mine for 12 years and never had any issues with the PS pump. Pretty reliable device. I used a Summit tube cooler, but I doubt if it was needed. The last few years I ran a Lee mod pump with the ram assist, & modified stock box. I did extend the filler on the pump to avoid spillage on the crappy roads here in Baja. This pump was a salvage ham can Sag directly from a van and I exchanged it for a Cardone rebuilt.

Here is the Stretch Bronco summary: Van pump, bracket*, & High pressure line, small in line filter in the return line, cooler in the return line, Stock box, Amsoil ATF. I used the stock pulley , but would recommend the smaller rock crawler pulley (Howe) for more poop at low speeds.
* New hardware store bolts for the AC compressor mount. Bracket was detailed for clearance for the sag pump.

Now days for the 72 Bronco I am using a sag pump with the PSC Shell adapter, remote res combined with Hydroboost, and ram assist. For that setup I had Red Ram mod the box, pump, and supply the ram with hoses, etc. Seems to work ok with Amsoil ATF? This one uses Earls stainless high pressure hose that came with the Hydrotech HB kit. All the fittings were correct, but I had to cut the high pressure line to fit.

Last of all I recommend using a Sag with the PSC shell adapter and a pricey res with 2 inputs in case you want to go with a HB at a later date.
The drill is take off the sag pump res and replace with the shell with a fat inlet and hope you get the clocking correct for the shell. The result is now the spillage comes from the res lid instead of the stock sag res. Which brings up which remote res to buy - Answer: Buy one with a sealed fill lid and an over board vent/overflow line. Live and learn that cheap ones spill on bad roads. Res = PSC or Howe not Ebay.
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Steering pump

Post by cs_drums »

shockseals.com wrote:and to be clear, the reman cardone 207878 pump from rock auto is not adequate with my Tommy Lee set up, the C2 pump was much better that was modified by Lee but it always made noise and it had 8 years on the clock so i figured good time to swap while its getting a motor.

Do to my super. Charger kit I had to switch back to the C2 pump from the van Saginaw.

I want to add a ram but wasn’t sure if the C2 was up to the challenge.

You were happy with the Lee unit other than the noise? Are the modifications something I could do myself like your explaining on the sag pump?

Also I have a van sag set up if anyone needs one...... or has a old lee C2 pump they want to tradeImage


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Re: Steering pump

Post by shockseals.com »

PaulW wrote: Here is the Stretch Bronco summary: Van pump, bracket*, & High pressure line, small in line filter in the return line, cooler in the return line, Stock box, Amsoil ATF. I used the stock pulley , but would recommend the smaller rock crawler pulley (Howe) for more poop at low speeds.
* New hardware store bolts for the AC compressor mount. Bracket was detailed for clearance for the sag pump.

van bracket required no modification/detailing on my 96 and the stock AC compressor bolts and the stock bracket to block bolts were reused without issue. Idle to 4000rpm the steering wheel spins like a forklift with the balance of parts being tommy lee box and ram. That small pulley could probably dismissed for the flow and pressure mod above thats fast and easy.

I didnt care for the routing of the van high pressure line since it was roughly 8" of hardline and not great routing with my cage so I made my own hose...YMMV
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PaulW
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Re: Steering pump

Post by PaulW »

The 96 has smaller metric AC bolts and the van bracket is non metric. If I remember correctly after 14 years.
I got the small pulley suggestion from Howe, but never did get one.
I do not remember how my high pres line went in sorry. I just bought on from NAPA and used it. I do remember it was kinda odd shape.
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funinthesun95
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Re: Steering pump

Post by funinthesun95 »

shockseals.com wrote:
funinthesun95 wrote:I know it adds some cost but the TC pump has worked well on the bronco. I have had both Sag and TC on the black bronco. Solo mods the stock bracket now and sells.

I just used the Howe steel mod adapter plate $25-30 at the time.

again you will need TC pump, pulley, and adapter and figure out lines. It is not plug and play but not that hard.

This would be if you can not find the Van stuff that is more bolt on and go.

I can look for the PDF that shows you how to mod the bracket on Howe web page....
I swapped not based on cost but based on P pump easy to get anywhere in baja and can be made to work as well as my Lee modified factory pump.

Is the TC pump available at any autoparts store? I thought it was race specific and required a remote resi, not just an easy grab at any vato zone in baja. If it is an OE replacement part whats the year/make/model to get one from so I can make note of that.

WIth the mod sag p pump if one ever fails, $35 at a local parts shop and swap the modified fitting and piston over and you are back in business was my only reason for swapping to the p pump. Mounting a remote resi was the second deal breaker after being able to source anywhere or I would have bought a complete race style set up from PSS or Howe.
Yes the TC pump is available at auto parts stores. It is a GM pump that lots of GM model Cars and Truck use. The Modified TC pump is Race specific like you said. Similar to your Tommy Lee stuff the shop mods for flow and lines...etc depending on application. I had a Cadillac TC pump in the parts bag on bronco and prepared it myself for my lines 80 bucks after fittings ( stock form they are 900-1250 PSI depending on unit). Nothing internal was done to it but it bolted up to my set up and would do it's job to allow me to continue on the trail or in Baja.

Even the big dog T pump you see on Trophy Trucks is just a industrial grade steering pump modified for off road use. You will see them on heavy equipment to run the steering and hydraulics.

I only went down this path because I had the TC pump. The P pump works just fine. Both will handle the ram assist and large tires.
Good people + Great info = GFB
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Re: Steering pump

Post by shockseals.com »

PaulW wrote:The 96 has smaller metric AC bolts and the van bracket is non metric. If I remember correctly after 14 years.
I got the small pulley suggestion from Howe, but never did get one.
I do not remember how my high pres line went in sorry. I just bought on from NAPA and used it. I do remember it was kinda odd shape.
Thats odd on the bolts...I reused my OEM 96 bronco compressor bolts on the van bracket(m6x1 I think). I got the van bracket from Vintage Iron here on GFB. Maybe he knows what year van it was in?
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PaulW
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Re: Steering pump

Post by PaulW »

I think you got a newer van bracket. Mine came from a buddies junk box - also unknown
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