Steering Systems - Stock, Superunner & Equal Len. Crossover

[Deleted Account]

ive never seen one of those setups that worked. they are worse then stock steering because of the twist.

[convoy]

Aside from the steering why use a heim? Isn't the uniball a better/stronger setup on the beam pivot

[ChaseTruck754]

Fabricator preference at that point I'd say. Most use uniballs, but obviously some use heims. It's like on the end of 2wd beams - both can work. They are both the same size bearing, just with the heim you may have to be worried about load on the shaft/shank of the thing. Mos thread the things all the way in so it isn't really a major issue. If you don't thread them all the way in you can make MINOR adjustments in track width though.

[philofab]

I can't ever see a heim breaking in that application. Remember that a lot of trucks use heims on the rear trailing arms and they live there.

Stock steering is good to a point, the downfall being the bump steer on the driver wheel and the tendency to bend the drag link from side forces from the driver wheel.

A single swinger is more expensive, more complicated, but CAN be stronger and less likely to bend. If done right the bump steer is reduced.

If I was going to take the time and money to build something I would build a single swinger. Copying the factory stuff is a waste of time and materials.

[funinthesun95]

This is why I posted it up this is great info and I learn more every day.... Thanks Guys

So Let's see what the old budget can afford and party on from there....

The Hiem over uniball not sure why they did it this way but both work. Philo is correct most of the load of the beam is from were it bumps on the frame on out ( please correct me if im wrong). The load decreases as you get to the pivot. At first look I thought maybe it was a 50/44HD beam and they added to the short pivot side of the beam. But I was wrong. The 44HD knuckles/hubs can be re drilled to 5 on 5.5 so i thought maybe???? (50 beams I have only seen re dill of 6 on 6.5)

FYI I’m not a fabricator just a guy that likes to know why things are done different ways. That way I can set my stuff up to be safe and beefy. I also like to make sure people don't bull shit me.....lol

[magic carpet XLT]

so since my last info thread squeezed some good tech out of you guys, lets try this again....

when i crawl under my van and stare at the steering, i see that it is pretty far from ideal. its just stock, and looks strong enough for stock stuff, but i don't like the geometry. the drivers side tie rod is like 33% shorter than the beam, but the passenger side is actually pretty close. it seems like making the drivers side longer would improve bump steer when that cycles, but then i would be introducing significantly more toe change when both cycle right? is this something that you guys just deal with, cause from what i remember broncos are pretty similar geometry wise?

i've had good luck in the past with the common 1 ton chevy tie rod ends most rock crawlers use and either heat treated 4130 or DOM directly tapped links, and i'd like to setup something simpler for my van if i can. those tie rods are very easy to find and quite a bit larger than ford stuff. i just don't like the fact that when the p-side joint goes, i have to replace the entire drag link as well.

i know the principles behind crossover, but for what i'm doing and the travel i'm running (~10") seems like it might be more trouble and money than its worth.

[philofab]

A single swinger gets rid of the bump steer on the drivers side... but it's hard to run straight links without clearance issues. To make thing even more complicated you have to take into consideration the camber change through travel and also the radius arm length. I assume your van is unequal length with kingpin beams?

For 10" of travel I would not worry about it. It affects more on the street than it does on the dirt as the lack of traction on dirt/sand makes it more forgiving.

[ryan B]

http://www.race-dezert.com/forum/showth ... sion-build

[1971Ford]

I made single swing steering for my f100 and it turned out great, and now it's time to do my brothers bronco, if it's worth it.

I noticed that the solo motorsports bronco (maybe one of the most built bronco's out there) still has stock-style steering. Maybe there is a reason they did not go to single swinger?

I haven't looked at my brothers bronco yet but I know the pitman is no where near being infront of the passenger beam's pivot although it might be pretty close to being in the line that the radius arm pivot, beam pivot, and pitman arm make... which would be good... But I dont think the swinger would be in the radius arm pivot/beam pivot line.
Am I making sense?

I understand how to setup single swinger and have done it on my equal length beamed f100 with great success but not sure if non-equal length TTB will be the same.

Also, how beneficial is single swinger steering on a bronco setup with a 14" coilover with maybe 16-17" travel over extended stock steering on a drop pitman?

[1971Ford]

Solo bronco on stock steering
http://garagemonkey.net/off-road/news1.html
Another built bronco
http://www.off-roadweb.com/features/090 ... to_01.html


Just wondering why they haven't gone to a swinger setup as they clearly have the resources and money to do so.

[philofab]

Single swinger does reduce the bump steer to the driver wheel. Stock steering can be bought anywhere and is super simple though.

If you do it right you can reinstall stock steering in a pinch.

Take a look at Kris' (shockseals.com) Bronco. He installed swinger steering on his and loves it. Rick also has one on his.

[gunit]

My Bronco uses single swing steering as well, no bump steer and much stronger too.

[TrevorPiggott]

So with Broncos, you can line up the swinger with the beam mount on the passenger side but on on the driver side the pitman will not line up with the beam mount. Therefore only one wheel really gets bumpsteer corrected? Is there any truth in what I just said?
Sorry if it's a dumb statement.

[philofab]

The passenger wheel does not have much bump steer stock, most of it is in the drivers wheel due to the short tie rod.

[TrevorPiggott]

Gotcha, thanks for the info Philo!

[TPiggott]

I say we do like gunit. It's pretty much the same as what Ryan did on his truck and that works out great.

[sydude]

I agree, Gunit's system is the one I'm eventually shooting for.

Gunit (or everyone else), quick question about 'flipping' the tie rod end to the top of the knuckle arm - is it a worthwhile change? I see that Gunit didn't do it on his setup, and I'm wondering why.

[MOSS2]

I agree, Gunit's system is the one I'm eventually shooting for.

Gunit (or everyone else), quick question about 'flipping' the tie rod end to the top of the knuckle arm - is it a worthwhile change? I see that Gunit didn't do it on his setup, and I'm wondering why.

Probably because they would hit the frame and other things.?

[philofab]

Gunit (or everyone else), quick question about 'flipping' the tie rod end to the top of the knuckle arm - is it a worthwhile change? I see that Gunit didn't do it on his setup, and I'm wondering why.

Probably because they would hit the frame and other things.?

I have the outer tie rods flipped on my crew cab. It created more bump steer and also has problems with them coming loose due to only having half a taper. No clearance issues on a stock setup, but with a single swinger it gets very tight at full bump between the frame and tie rod.

[motoxscott]

Here's a picture of the swing-set steering I've been working on .... for a while. Just need to final weld it up, double shear the pitman arm and make the final tie rods and plate in the swingers. I'm gonna use 1.25" x .375w 4130 tubing for the tie rods so all I have to do is drill & tap the ends, no welding thread bungs in. I'm also gonna send them out to get heat-treated since it doesn't cost that much to do. Also planning on running a bolt-on strut between the swingers to add support and also somehow mount the ram to.

Cycling the suspension 22", bumpsteer is measured in 1/8"s not inches haha The amount of mock-up and cycling & measuring to get it to this point was unreal.

- Scott