Power Steering Pump Upgrades/Coolers

[DMbronco]

Big fan of the hydroboost- It's defintely an improvement over stock, and enough of an upgrade I opted not to
go with disc brakes when I went through the rear end. Other than some powerslot rotors up front, everything else is
stock brakewise. More than enough for me, esp with the ABS gone.

Re: the sag swap, I found a pump, bracket and pulley off an E-Series van. I called quite a few yards and dropped by a few before I found one.

Then I had a bit of a challenge finding a Sag pump with enough returns for the brakes and steering pump (didnt want to tee it off).
Ended up with a Sag Pump from a 2007 Chevy Silverado 2500. Yes, I looked at three different pumps before I found that one. Lemme know if I can dig up a part number for you.

Working on pics of the coolers too

[robertcrav]

Here are Brays pics...

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ImageUploadedByTapatalk1380080141.507412.jpg (37.64 KiB) Viewed 1042 times

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ImageUploadedByTapatalk1380080172.787884.jpg (35.88 KiB) Viewed 1042 times

[robertcrav]

Topless whore pic... Couldn't resist, sorry Bray

ImageUploadedByTapatalk1380080219.541129.jpg (73.8 KiB) Viewed 1041 times

[Seabass]

I have already done the sag swap. The cans are interchangeable if you ever want to change it. Psc and howe make cans with dual returns and remote resivours.

What year super duty did your hydroboost come off of? Wondering how different chevy hydro boost masters would be. Theres a billion astrovans at all the yards....

[PaulW]

Reminded me to document my PS pumps. The take off parts are in CO and the questions always arrive when I am in Baja for the winter.
My 72 pump is the one pictured on page 1 Cardone # 20-6244 now 20-7272 and uses the horseshoe bracket. This is a typical ford replacement with the 0.68" shaft which allows use of stock pulley. Not real thrilled with this pump and I will probably upgrade when/if AC is added?
This rig has Hydroboost with a soft pedal so pump upgrade is probably needed along with better bleeding. Cooler is a cobbled up tube unit from my take off pile. It has hos fittings. . It has the same filter as below on the 96

My 96 has the ham can Sag off a 95 E150 Cardone # 20-7878. Done years ago so maybe there is a new number? This unit has a 0.75" shaft so the e150 pulley must be used (96 came with a 0.68" shaft Ford pump). It is mounted to the e150 bracket with new AC bolts and slight grinding of the bracket. This is the most common conversion for a fsb and there are literally hundreds of threads for this conversion. The conversion uses the stock e150 high pressure line. My filter is hose to hose ARI #2209 for the 3/8" hose.
My cooler is the low cost tube (not plate) from Summit its about 3 or 4 x 12 or 14. Hose ends.
Recently I had the pump at T. Lee and he detailed it for my ram setup. I think he flow tested it and changed the pressure.

Fluids for the 96 has always been Amsoil full syn ATF. The 72 has been using atf type f.
Discussed fluids with Howe and he said use GM PS fluid. I have some, but it sits on the shelf so far since I have no need. Now Howe has his own brand.

72 uses 2 ford 460 coolers from the JY. The 96 has a blower b&m & the stock trailer cooler the came with the Bronco. All coolers are plate coolers.
72 has Aeroquip high pressure hoses that came with the HB kit and rubber return line hoses.
Both PS pumps above have single return cans, and neither use a separate res.
PaulW

[Seabass]

Howe now sells an adapter bracket and pulley to run a TC style pump on a ford bracket. These are supposed to be way more efficient than the spam can pumps.

[PaulW]

what is a TC style?

[baja-chris]

TC is a type of Saginaw pump that is very common on late model cars and is often used on race cars. I think there is an aluminum and an iron version. The aluminum one is typically what you get if you buy a new pump from Lee or Howe, and they usually modify it based on what it's driving (ram etc.) TC aluminum pump first appeared on corvette if memory serves.

Regarding hydroboost, I don't like how stomping on the brakes can rob steering boost. I did a setup on a race truck that used two independent hydraulic circuits (2 pumps, 2 coolers, 2 resis) and it worked great. For belt drive, I just slaved the second pump off the first with a v-belt. Never had belt slip issues.

[PaulW]

Same for me and I run electric brake boost and the PS pump just operates the steering

[DMbronco]

hey Seabass,

I believe all hydroboost came from a 96 f350, but it's been some time and I could be wrong.

Will check some PPW over the weekend and confirm

[philofab]

GM hydroboost can be used easily with our trucks. My 86 F250 has it, with only a fabricated pin to get length correct.

[Seabass]

I read somewhere the firewall pattern was different as well as ford being standard fittings and gm being metric or visa versa. Any other info on this philo? what are you doing for the pedal rod? I know theres a lot of discussion on pin placement on the pedal for ford to ford swaps. I could go to any junkyard tommorow and find a dozen astro vans but not one hydro boosted f series. Id be stoked to get this done while gutting my abs and running new lines.

[philofab]

I read somewhere the firewall pattern was different as well as ford being standard fittings and gm being metric or visa versa. Any other info on this philo? what are you doing for the pedal rod? I know theres a lot of discussion on pin placement on the pedal for ford to ford swaps. I could go to any junkyard tommorow and find a dozen astro vans but not one hydro boosted f series. Id be stoked to get this done while gutting my abs and running new lines.

I am running a Ford master cylinder. No fittings need to be changed that way. Let me take some photos.

[Seabass]

I appreciate the help. Should of been more specific. The sae to metric issue was for the high side threaded port going into the booster.

Ford master bolts to the chevy booster? Awesome! Firewall as well? It couldn't be that easy could it?

[PaulW]

hey Seabass,

I believe all hydroboost came from a 96 f350, but it's been some time and I could be wrong.

=====
Yup you are wrong. All diesel trucks have HB. The most common junk yard swap is from a Chevy Astro doner.
And of course there are many suppliers of custom HB that will fit a Bronco just fine.
Using a Ford SD HB is not on the preferred list due to the Ford pump.
Don't forget it was GM that first started using HB and the other guys copied later.
HB are great for stopping in a straight line with no steering.
PaulW

[Seabass]

Paul, do you know what firewall bracket is used for the astro hb?

The straight line comment. Do you mean that in a good way where the brakes lock up very well or in a bad way where they operate like a light switch and feeling is lost?

[ChaseTruck754]

I think the Astro adapter is different. IF you were to get one to bolt on my bet is it would be one from an "F superduty" which was a F-450 or 550. Same era as the broncos = 95-97ish would do it.

I've got a hydroboost out of a '01 sitting in my '74. I had to make a spacer/adapter to bolt it to the firewall & get the plunger length set right for my pedal stroke.

SquirrelyMurphy has an Astro van one on his '73 F-100 I think. Maybe he will see this & chime in on the specifics of that.

[PaulW]

Paul, do you know what firewall bracket is used for the astro hb?

The straight line comment. Do you mean that in a good way where the brakes lock up very well or in a bad way where they operate like a light switch and feeling is lost?

=====
Don't know. For info read the EB forums where all the Astro conversions are used.. Most are on the 5.0 & 5.8 conversions so they all should be applicable to any big Bronco.

One pump for two functions at the same time means less power to both. (However one pump and a ram assist works fine)
Example park on a hill and have to backup with the brakes on and steer out of the parking place at the same time and you will find the harder you push the pedal the harder it is to steer. My super duty behaves like that as does all stock HB setups.
Solution:
* 2 PS pumps like Chris' old race truck and many other race setups.
* Keep the vac booster
* Go with electric boost like I did on my 96.
So with HB one has to know its limitations. Straight line braking is great - light pedal for way good braking. Steering and braking not so great and your experience will vary.
PaulW

[toddz69]

Paul, do you know what firewall bracket is used for the astro hb?

The straight line comment. Do you mean that in a good way where the brakes lock up very well or in a bad way where they operate like a light switch and feeling is lost?

=====
Don't know. For info read the EB forums where all the Astro conversions are used.. Most are on the 5.0 & 5.8 conversions so they all should be applicable to any big Bronco.

One pump for two functions at the same time means less power to both. (However one pump and a ram assist works fine)
Example park on a hill and have to backup with the brakes on and steer out of the parking place at the same time and you will find the harder you push the pedal the harder it is to steer. My super duty behaves like that as does all stock HB setups.
Solution:
* 2 PS pumps like Chris' old race truck and many other race setups.
* Keep the vac booster
* Go with electric boost like I did on my 96.
So with HB one has to know its limitations. Straight line braking is great - light pedal for way good braking. Steering and braking not so great and your experience will vary.
PaulW

I've had the "no or very little" steering with hydroboost issue from time to time on my Super Duty as well. I place the blame on the inadequacy of the Ford C-II pumps.

OTOH, I've had 4 different hydroboost setups with two different pumps (Sag canned ham and Explorer C-III) on my Bronco and have never had the "no steering while braking" issue with it and the Bronco has larger tires than the Super Duty does.

The Super Duty booster is a great one to use - just don't use the stock Ford SD pump with it.

Todd Z.

[toddz69]

I appreciate the help. Should of been more specific. The sae to metric issue was for the high side threaded port going into the booster.

Ford master bolts to the chevy booster? Awesome! Firewall as well? It couldn't be that easy could it?

The SAE-to-metric changeover occurred on all hydroboosts in the 1980 model year.

Ford and Dodge master cylinders all have 3.2" mounting bolt spacing and Chevy has 3.4" mounting bolt spacing so some reworking of the bolt holes may be necessary if you're mixing and matching.

Todd Z.